US to divide Afghanistan, Pakistan and Iran?

[NokiaWnW]

australia is run on a federalism system and we have local councils and state and federal governance. these are all voted for. the state representatives then have a say in parliament. i consider this system, similar to having tribal heads although how those tribal heads are chosen, may be different.
there is no way karzai should be choosing governors for a region. they should be representatives of the local people

Many countries have federalism as their only funtional system. French, Switzerland, Autrich, Germany, Kanada, Kosovo, Albania ...

[abassinafghan]

most people tend to be a little to naive.



some of you named countries which have a federal structure ,

but this federal structure just regard to the administrational and excecuitv nature to some degree also to fiscal nature . but not to a political nature .

in none of the named countries any of the "gouvenors" ,"ministerpräsidenten " , or "prefects " ,would be allowed to run his own millizia armed and payed by foreign countries .or to talk open over sezession . or to make local deals on their on their onbehalf with foreign nations !!!!

how ever this happend over the last 20 years on a permanent base , so we had already a existing form of federalism . and the result was 20 years of suffering and misery .

the afghan society in a political manner , has been broken and destructed a long time ago .

there are no political parties ,there are no political movements , worth naming . not the northern alliance is a movement nor the taliban , both are just armed groups paid from outside , to take over controll on their behalf .

both of them dont offer anything than hollow slogans and stupid remarks , just go over to this tajikam forum , or look at france and germany , what this people are propagating there ... ethnofacism , and they even plunder their own "beloved" tajiks.

and our talib lalas here on the board , not mentioned any thing but , muslim brotherhood , and how evil will end etc.. but i never heard them to talk about how they goona imagine a solution for the daily suffering of our people , dying from hunger or dying from american bullets is at the end the same result you are dead.


so a country as afghanistan need a strong central goverment , an iron fist who smash any seperatist or troublemaker .

but what we one and foremost need as some of you named it , the integration of all qaums , the fear of our neighbours , say it the iranians or the pakis , are our unity .because then they will loose any influence .

that were also the reason why they supported only extremists and mainiacs , imagine the taliban had not flushed over samte shamal and dont killed to some degree also innocent people or raped ? and i mean they did in som areas of shamal this things .
they would have been in a totally different position today .!!!! they would be not hated by those peoples to this degree !!! and those things happend by a certain direction and intention , not just by emotions of get even , they were orderd . and there some commanders among the taliban and also some footsoldiers who refused to do so ,and they were removed . i know a former driver of them who , witnessed this and who left .

and the same case with the na , you wont find reasonable men among them , because they exactly know as a minority to ruler OVER the majority , has got a high price . so they need foreing support to establish such kind of rule

and alot of people will take revenge , on the other side , the foreigner will not support any one , who will set up a power frame which board enough and stable that he will be accepted and respected by the majority as the minority

they just skip fuel into the fire in which our people burning , and as long we burn , they profit .

the reason why they call now for federalism is they wanna get out , and share power with the taliban .

the taliban can not win this war military , however the americans and westerners can not win it political !!!! its a pat situation !
they lost the war already 2001 when they overestimated their socalled allies the na .

so they give them an offer they meet in between , the south and east will go to the taliban and hekmatyar, the north will go to the na ****bags , ata , dostum , mahsud , sayyaf , and the west will stay with ismael .

and there will be an equilibrium of uncertainty , no one will be strong enough to grap power on their onbehalf , or on the behalf of outsiders , here and then if som one tries they will be pulled back by the others , one time the taliban , one time the others .

that is how they will controll us and keep us down , and mixed with fear and hatred among our people , our beuatiful country and people will be left over. while others fill their pockets on our suffering .

i dont think it will lead to seperation but , the danger our neighbours will take a grasp , as soon the americans lost interesst in 20 or 30 years , when the the gas field of central aisa are depleted ,exists . thats the reason why , dostum is welcomed in ankara , why the iranians fund the hazaras and treat ismael well . why the tajiks ,propagated their khorossan story . and why we hear here on pf , the muslim brotherhood story .

because 3 or 4 new small states would create even more chaos , but a political divison is the perfect solution for them at the moment.
and what the future holds for us , is not their concern .

[NokiaWnW]

You forget one thing. Afghanistan is not a federal state and also not a democratical state tough officially called so. Afghanistan was previour the civil war into an iron´s hands but those small groups took that iron fist and broke it. The time when government was able to have weapons as alone power is over. Tody, everyone can get a weapon. We have warlordism in Afghanistan because of tribalism, regionalism, ethnical identity, cultural identity, religious groups ...otherwise the Karzai gov is still a ethno-centric power-pool and he became a dictator. He just follow the same **** what his ''moftkhor'' ancestors did that you seem to be proud of and according to your understanding the only right step. Yesterday, we were de facto ''united'', but many Pashtuns started to oppress Hazaras, taking lands from them, sending Pashtun nomads to north and grabbing their lands, colonialization of north began.... you call this unity or you think unity will be established that way? The problem with people like you is that you are peeing in your pants knowing that an ''ethnical'' monopoly will be smashed down in Afghanistan by federalism. You accept bloodshed, war, civil wars just not to lose your power. If again a civil war starts, you will not only lose your monopoly but even much more! The Pakis are waiting for a war, such as Iran, Russia, US ... either to make a compromis with those represents of the rest of the country or accepting to be devided and becoming part of Pakistan, Iran and other states. You can good talking, living in the West in your warmly four corners. We want a united country, not losing any inch of our beloved ground, than we need to reform our state. Dropping of ethnocentric policies and bring all players to the same table.

[abassinafghan]

oh candolake farsisaban , who sits next to kharzi , is it not the same dostum , is it not the very same fahim , is it not the very same ata, or saleh ???

besides i didnt mentioned any ethno centric means or even any regard to it? i for myself like dr. bachardost alot , even he is a shia even he is a hazara , but he names the problems . and i have no problem with him being president , because he is afghan .

besides kandolak you showed your true colours , go back you come from , and stop playing the patriotic afghan

because again you started to talk trahs , what have accomplished any of your beloved na ,leaders for your own tajiks in the last 10 years ?
what have done kharzai for his pashtuns or dostum for his uzbeks . nothing !!!

you may have inferrior complexes but that is your problem not my , i have no problem with tajiks hazaras or uzbeks or turkmans , as long they are good people , and dont are on payrolls of foreign nations , filling up their pockets with american help , and spreading hatred .

i can gurantee you your so called federalistic "system " will fail , and you really thinks , that mazar or balkh or herat ,will be safe and prospour and be independent , dream on son the only ones who bark and cry are your cousins , who know that the only true amir sahib is coming hahahaha

[NokiaWnW]

oh candolake farsisaban , who sits next to kharzi , is it not the same dostum , is it not the very same fahim , is it not the very same ata, or saleh ???

besides i didnt mentioned any ethno centric means or even any regard to it? i for myself like dr. bachardost alot , even he is a shia even he is a hazara , but he names the problems . and i have no problem with him being president , because he is afghan .

besides kandolak you showed your true colours , go back you come from , and stop playing the patriotic afghan

because again you started to talk trahs , what have accomplished any of your beloved na ,leaders for your own tajiks in the last 10 years ?
what have done kharzai for his pashtuns or dostum for his uzbeks . nothing !!!

you may have inferrior complexes but that is your problem not my , i have no problem with tajiks hazaras or uzbeks or turkmans , as long they are good people , and dont are on payrolls of foreign nations , filling up their pockets with american help , and spreading hatred .

i can gurantee you your so called federalistic "system " will fail , and you really thinks , that mazar or balkh or herat ,will be safe and prospour and be independent , dream on son the only ones who bark and cry are your cousins , who know that the only true amir sahib is coming hahahaha

Next to Karzai sit mostly non-Pashtuns. Gulbuddinis and Taliban sympatizers. Stop talking non sense (btw, I am not a Farsiwan in the correct meaning). The problem is that Karzai use his ethnicity to establish again a dynasty of sellouts and his own Pashtun people will be suffering the most and at the same time pretending to work for Pashtuns. One need to execute that dirty ISI and CIA agent. He sells Afghanistan to Pakistan and the coward amir al mumeenen does not show only one time himself and his dogs are mostly coward suicide bombers hiding under Burqas, killing innocent people. Just yesterday, they attacked again Paktia and Kandahar and dozen were killed. Pakistan will not leave Afghanistan if all Afghans won´t stand against them as a real united community. And a unification starts when everything runs fairly. Without any ethnical agendas, bringing language issue to politics, fighting over a province or lands. But these bloody *******s came after 09/11 out of nowhere, mostly from the west and today enrich themself with the money of US, so the Taliban rats and Paki slaves. If we don´t find a common sense we all will lose that war. Neither Taliban will this time able to take anything, except there where they are welcomed nor any other power. And federalism would be the first and easiest way for a further nation-building and a real unification of Afghanistan...

[Ghundal]

Pakifief paki ANP faggot spreading lies here that Pashtuns like drone attacks

House niggeeeeerrrr

Keep your **** lies to yourself u fagggot ANP paki

Secular trash

[abassinafghan]

nokia , one simple question you make karzai , who got no support not even from his own pashtuns , not even the people of his home village karz , look soo powerfull , he is only on the mercy of the american on his chair , he can be replaced in the blink of an eye .


but you complain about the pakis ,and how afghans must stand again them and their lapdogs the taliban .


who is paying the pakis ? who is supporting them , the international community granted the pakis in the last decade 40 billion usd in cash aid .

why do you not question american politicis in the region , the politicis of the master instead the politics of the servant ( pakistan ) why are so quiet about this topic ???

[NokiaWnW]

Pakifief paki ANP faggot spreading lies here that Pashtuns like drone attacks

House niggeeeeerrrr

Keep your **** lies to yourself u fagggot ANP paki

Secular trash

Yeah, insulting everyone as ''secularist'' who show you reality.. is that everything you hypocrite wannabe Jihadists of the WWW can all the day?

http://journal.georgetown.edu/wp-content/uploads/Drone-Attacks-Inside-Pakistan-Wayang-or-Willing-Suspension-of-Disbelief.pdf

The people want the terrorists out of their cities, villages and valleys. Look to the people who are freed from rats like Taliban... how they support their freedom-bringers... no matter who they are.

http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/2010/01/09/pakistan-in-defence-of-drones/

Btw, my islamic belief is by far more rooted than your filthy nature.... you try to excuse with Islam!

[Ghundal]

uncle Tom,

The people hate you. You can't walk in Afghanistan or FATA.

You are a filthy paki liar. And you are a paki because only a pakifief paki supports drone attacks and the war in Afghanistan.

These faggots such as yourself support these wars while having personal comfort( your family is safe)

You are an Uncle Tom house negroe, and all your filthy drunk posts prove it

[NokiaWnW]

The time has come for the implementation of Article 69 of the constitution. The president wants to drag the country to instability, not stability. If he does not resign then he should be kicked from the presidential palace. He does nt deserve to be our President.

[Amir al Ghaznavi]

there isnt an ounce of difference between any of the NA leaders or the Karzai mafia. Include the Taliban in that as well.

we need a strong united pan ethnic islamic movement to unite the country


no to federalism now. this is double speak for separation

[faye]

ghundal, you are losing it. you are capable of good debating, why are you resorting to this ridiculous level and using african americans as an insult?

[retro]

australia is run on a federalism system and we have local councils and state and federal governance. these are all voted for. the state representatives then have a say in parliament. i consider this system, similar to having tribal heads although how those tribal heads are chosen, may be different.
there is no way karzai should be choosing governors for a region. they should be representatives of the local people

I agree, that Karzai is overly centralising Afghanistan's structures. Maybe they need, local elections and more power needs to be devolved from the centre. However you can't govern a nation like Afghanistan by consensus.

[faye]

i was just explaining how federalism works. i had to google the word myself, lol. i thought australia was just a democracy but it is classified as a federal system, that we have.

[SiiNii]

I don't have anything to add at this time but I just wanted to say that this was a very informative and interesting thread until page three.