Why did the Taliban ban long hair?

[ScimitarXEdge]

This is a serrated plastic knife

a serrated plastic string is not going to work the same way.

it's sad to see your logic gates so worn down from Taliban defending

you can actually make plastic into rigid angles which can cut through string under the right pressuer, without cutting flesh/tissue. and yes this can be put on a string; you'll be amazed what can be done with plastic. it is after all the 21st century.

I have never supported the Taliban but I will do my best to explain why people do what they do and once we figure out the root cause of the problem, then we can figure out the solution, your a scientist, you should know this.

but your arguments are so blatantly asinine and easily refuted....your explanations cannot be anything but blind defense

I am speculating the Talibans angle was safety as well as gambling,

That's called back peddling. you seem to forget your own words which leads to a boomerang effect.

Now I dont know about you but if someone is flying a kite with a glass coated string around a child,

Then change the materials to make them safe for kids, don't ban stuff just for some issue that can be repaired. That's irrational....the safety excuse is pure horsehit

aren't Taliban concerned for the safety of children when they suicide bomb in crowd of MUSLIM CIVILIAN women and children? (so you don't use the Israeli colonialization of Palestinians being assaulted scapegoat)

The Taliban did ban soccer at the beginning but the people protested so they unbanned it. Them Afghan love soccer.

so basically their concern for gambling AS YOU suggested wasn't as strong s they said they were. See how inconsistent you get?

they even talked about lifting the ban TV.

talk is talk

the point here is let the society evolve on its own and let them learn from their mistakes

the taliban weren't cave men who never knew of these things; alternative solutions already existed in Afghanistan from long before. The argument of social evolution wouldn't be applicable. The "mistakes" were already made long before them. They were merely holding people down out of brainwashed dogma.

Of course the Taliban are incompetent, but why don't you tell us which Afghan administration is competent.

That's not an excuse .....the solution to incompetence is competence, not MORE incompetence. The Talibans rules prevented educated people from effectively making appropriate changes and applications because of some absurd deobandi interpretation of Islamic Legal rights

Even according to the Hanafi Madhab, the Taliban's edicts were deemed a more rigid and impractical Mushrab and this is explained by the Syrian, Turkish, Iraqi and Egyptin aHnaf.

I would be the last person to defend the Taliban and at the same time I cant even bring myself to defend any of the other administrations.

Lack of Taliban doesn't necessarily mean the other incompetent groups are the alternative

[Afghanistan2010]

@members of PF

(scimerattheEDGE TO JUMP TO HELL)
Lack of knowledge and attention,and more probably workless is the cause that this person has so much posts in PF

[IamDZJ]

headlice

[khushal]

you can actually make plastic into rigid angles which can cut through string under the right pressuer, without cutting flesh/tissue. and yes this can be put on a string; you'll be amazed what can be done with plastic. it is after all the 21st century.

First you have to realize that this sport is not regulated or controlled by anyone. What i have said that there should be regulation set up by a governing body where people can play this sport in a controlled environment.
Second, no country in the world would allow people to fly kites that have specially made to cut glass coated string in the middle of the city where people can come to harm.
Third if you have the solution then you should market your product to Afghanistan, Pakistan and India, you can become very rich because that's a market of over 1.5 billion people. Note that people will use thread that cuts the best.

but your arguments are so blatantly asinine and easily refuted....your explanations cannot be anything but blind defense

You explaining Afghan society to us is like Kaish explaining Evolution to us. Both of you have no idea of what your talking about.

That's called back peddling. you seem to forget your own words which leads to a boomerang effect.

No one knows what was in the minds of the Taliban who made these decisions. We can only speculate just like we don't know what are in the minds of US policy makers today and what were they thinking when they invaded Iraq, we can only speculate.

Then change the materials to make them safe for kids, don't ban stuff just for some issue that can be repaired. That's irrational....the safety excuse is pure horsehit

They didnt even have enough food for the population let alone spend resources for the research and development for kite flying string.

aren't Taliban concerned for the safety of children when they suicide bomb in crowd of MUSLIM CIVILIAN women and children? (so you don't use the Israeli colonialization of Palestinians being assaulted scapegoat)

Different era one is pre 9/11 and the other is post 9/11

so basically their concern for gambling AS YOU suggested wasn't as strong s they said they were. See how inconsistent you get?

policy changes over time. read about prohibition, about abortion, capital punishment in the US.

the taliban weren't cave men who never knew of these things; alternative solutions already existed in Afghanistan from long before. The argument of social evolution wouldn't be applicable. The "mistakes" were already made long before them. They were merely holding people down out of brainwashed dogma.

No, you are wrong. Society when destroyed sometimes looses what they had at one time. For example the Romans build some of the best concrete where their roads and bridges still stand. After the fall of the Roman empire, the Europeans lost the knowledge on how to build good concrete and were using rocks and mud for a thousand years after they once had knowledge. Baghdad was once the capital of peace and wisdom, today Baghdad's citizens main concern is security.
The Taliban were of the rural population, not urban. they were not aware of modern methods or had any knowledge on how to run ministries. It were the urban people that used foreign forces to invade their way of life and tried to force them into the order.

That's not an excuse .....the solution to incompetence is competence, not MORE incompetence. The Talibans rules prevented educated people from effectively making appropriate changes and applications because of some absurd deobandi interpretation of Islamic Legal rights

The solution to incompetence is learning. In the Talibans view the urban educated people used foreign forces to invade them, they had betrayed them. Trust was lost that only time could bring back.

Lack of Taliban doesn't necessarily mean the other incompetent groups are the alternative

When is this alternative supposed to show up.

[faye]

khushal, how was it the urban people bringing in the invaders? the americans had afghanistan in their sights , long before they went in, because of osamas training camps, apparently.

[khushal]

khushal, how was it the urban people bringing in the invaders? the americans had afghanistan in their sights , long before they went in, because of osamas training camps, apparently.

Its about perception. To the rural population perception it were the urbanites that brought the Soviets in, and it were the urbanites that brought the Americans in. Most rural Afghans haven't even heard of 9/11. If the invaders actually respected local customs and did not interfere with local disputes, there would not be this violence at the level you see it at today. The rural population directly blames the urbanites for the foreign forces disrespecting of their customs and culture.

there was a time when the urban and the rural left each other alone and that was during the time of Zahir Shah, he knew the secrete. The feudal urbanites and the tribal rurals are socially and economically structured differently, so you must keep a balance between them. That balance was jeopardized when Daud kicked Zahir Shah out of the country and it has not been repaired. The Soviet's policy and the American's policy are the same and are contradictory to the balance of these two different societies.

[randolph85]

afghanistan never had a large urban population, and even now the urban population are living in nearly the same condition as the rural folk.

[randolph85]

First you have to realize that this sport is not regulated or controlled by anyone. What i have said that there should be regulation set up by a governing body where people can play this sport in a controlled environment.
Second, no country in the world would allow people to fly kites that have specially made to cut glass coated string in the middle of the city where people can come to harm.
Third if you have the solution then you should market your product to Afghanistan, Pakistan and India, you can become very rich because that's a market of over 1.5 billion people. Note that people will use thread that cuts the best.

how is it that a regime that pretty much wiped out petty crime because of the fear of punishment that they instilled in people were unable to regulate something as small as kite flying?

on the flip side, no country in the world would punish someone for not having a certain length of beard.

the rural vs urban argument is overstated here. afghanistans urban population were mostly kabulis, other cities were more like large villages rather than large urban centers. lets not forget that most of the leaders of the jihad were urban educated islamists.

policy changes over time. read about prohibition, about abortion, capital punishment in the US.

our policy is supposed to be based on 1400 yr old scripture. something that was followed far better and closely more than a thousand years ago than now.

No, you are wrong. Society when destroyed sometimes looses what they had at one time. For example the Romans build some of the best concrete where their roads and bridges still stand. After the fall of the Roman empire, the Europeans lost the knowledge on how to build good concrete and were using rocks and mud for a thousand years after they once had knowledge. Baghdad was once the capital of peace and wisdom, today Baghdad's citizens main concern is security.
The Taliban were of the rural population, not urban. they were not aware of modern methods or had any knowledge on how to run ministries. It were the urban people that used foreign forces to invade their way of life and tried to force them into the order.

the taliban were not the welcoming type. i dont think they were open to ideas other than their own. how is it that their governance was a complete mess but they had soviet trained soldiers flying their helicopters and jets? blaming everything to a rural upbringing is white washing things. i think common sense tells us that ministers should not be actively participating in battles while their office is empty for months at a time.

Different era one is pre 9/11 and the other is post 9/11

so in one era they were stupid but had good intentions but in this era are now committing evil acts and these acts overshadow whatever good intentions they think they have.

[khushal]

afghanistan never had a large urban population, and even now the urban population are living in nearly the same condition as the rural folk.

You are correct Randolph, that is exactly the reason that the urbanites need foreign assistance in their struggle against the Rurals. If left alone the rurals would overwhelm the urbanites which everyone expects would happen if the Americans leave.
I dont really know what you mean by living in the same condition. There are differences. People living in cities or close to cities have mainly detribalized, they may claim to be descendant from certain tribes but they are not living like they belong to a tribe or really follow tribal customs. Tribal customs dont really work in the urban way of life where their is central authority. The urban way of life does not really work in tribal mountains of Afghanistan where there is no law or central authority, the gun is basically the law. The Taliban were trying to force the Tribal way of life on the city folk by forcing customs on them that were foreign to them, and the city folk are trying to force the urban way of life or customs on the tribal folk which is foreign to them.

Since there is so much tribal conflict, they do need assistance in resolving this conflict. The tribesmen do respect good mediators in resolving this conflict. Zahir Shahs administration always provided this assistance but they never interfered in the conflict. The mediators responsibility is to be unbiased. Today the Taliban are filling in that void and they are doing a very good job of being unbiased mediators. The afghan governments structure of central system(Who the American and the Soviets opted for) instead of a wiser federal system(who Zahir shah administration and also the Pakistani Government in FATA has opted for) has failed and is only fueling corruption in the Government.
The Afghan government was doomed to fail from the beginning because of an ill advised decision to build a government under a central system.

[khushal]

how is it that a regime that pretty much wiped out petty crime because of the fear of punishment that they instilled in people were unable to regulate something as small as kite flying?

They did regulate it as cheaply as possible, and that was to completely ban it, and Pakistan has done the same thing after peoples throats were sliced. The problem is that you westerners don't really understand the sport of kite flying in south and central Asia. When a Kite runners put their kite up in the air in the middle of the city, they are basically egging another kite runner to fight him in the air, its a challenge. Nobody can tell what kind of thread the kite runner is using until you locate the location of the kite runner and check up close if the thread is dangerous or not. No one really has the time to locate the kite runner, check his thread to see if it is according to safety standard every time a kite is flying in the air.

on the flip side, no country in the world would punish someone for not having a certain length of beard.

red herring

the rural vs urban argument is overstated here. afghanistans urban population were mostly kabulis, other cities were more like large villages rather than large urban centers. lets not forget that most of the leaders of the jihad were urban educated islamists.

Sounds like you have never been to Afghanistan. Cities are cities, not large villages. You don't even know what a village is in Afghanistan.
Leaders can be from anywhere or educated anywhere but that does not really matter. A leader makes his decision based on where he is getting his support from. The Islamists main support were from the rurals and the leaders abided to the decisions of the supporters.

Hekmatyar used to be a Marxist but because he couldn't get a large following of marxist ideas in afghanistan, he changed course and went the route of where he can have supporters. So in essence, the leader couldnt change the people into marxists, but the people changed him into an Islamist. You see here Randolph, the leader is not independent but the people are. You must do what the people want you to do.

the taliban were not the welcoming type. i dont think they were open to ideas other than their own. how is it that their governance was a complete mess but they had soviet trained soldiers flying their helicopters and jets? blaming everything to a rural upbringing is white washing things. i think common sense tells us that ministers should not be actively participating in battles while their office is empty for months at a time.

All the people that had any knowledge of running ministries either ran away or died in the fighting.

so in one era they were stupid but had good intentions but in this era are now committing evil acts and these acts overshadow whatever good intentions they think they have.

The environment dictates the people not the other way around. But It has more to do with the authorities(the Americans) bad policy.
human beings naturally react extremely to chaotic events because of fear. It takes real smart level headed leadership to react moderately.

For example. Look at the financial crises that started in 2008. The reaction by governments all over the world is not of smart levelheaded leadership but are reacting extremely because of fear. Governments are printing money like crazy(extreme reaction) and are over regulating the market(extreme reaction). This is natural. The same extreme reaction was witnessed during the great depression. No matter how much we study history, we are doomed to repeat it because we are human.
http://www.stanford.edu/~johntayl/FCPR.pdf

[pashtanajan]

because it made people laugh and smile and be happy

Apparently it was banned because it was prejudiced towards Pasthuns. Pashtuns being a majority in Afghanistan would have surely not liked it. I've watched the movie and it has some aspects that could be seen as discriminatory, but nevertheless it's still a pretty good film to watch.

I'd like to mention it kind of idealizes Afghanistan before the war, and portrays Kabul as a very forward capital in a backward country. However in reality, Kabul was "modern" in terms of fashion, and was headed nowhere in terms of technology.

- Just my two cents.

[Soldat_Amir]

Why did they ban other things, its because they are retarded.

Ok, the North Koreans banned long hair, because they considered a short back and side as a ideal socialists hair cutt, while on the other hand, what is Taliban's justification?

In my view, they probably banned it because it would be much easier for the ISI to see which sheep is marked and wouldnt get lost

Oh the humor!

[Samandri]

Its surprising because Hazrat Muhammad P.B.U.H used to have shoulder length hairs. Deobandi Mullahs in our ares instead stress on shaved-heads. Talibs in Deobandi madrassas of Pakistan also shave their heads, Taliban regime in Afghanistan must have picked it from there when they were students. I think Wahabis also prefer shaved-heads. I read in a article about Khawarij that, they used to characteristically keep their heads shaved.

The Wazirs and Mehsuds keep long hairs as it is cultural tradition among them. When Waziri Taliban first appeared in our areas adjacent to waziristan, there was talk among locals that why these Taliban have such long hairs like loafars (i.e Taliban are not supposed to keep long hairs, why they have it?)

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

Its surprising because Hazrat Muhammad P.B.U.H used to have shoulder length hairs. Deobandi Mullahs in our ares instead stress on shaved-heads. Talibs in Deobandi madrassas of Pakistan also shave their heads, Taliban regime in Afghanistan must have picked it from there when they were students. I think Wahabis also prefer shaved-heads. I read in a article about Khawarij that, they used to characteristically keep their heads shaved.

The Wazirs and Mehsuds keep long hairs as it is cultural tradition among them. When Waziri Taliban first appeared in our areas adjacent to waziristan, there was talk among locals that why these Taliban have such long hairs like loafars (i.e Taliban are not supposed to keep long hairs, why they have it?)

My relatives from Kabul told me they didn't ban long hair. They banned those European style hairstyle where part of the hair is cut short and other parts left to grow longer making the hair look funny. Especially in early 90's many Afghans in Kabul use to have these silly hairstyles which offended religious people. It was considered as a sign of immorality.

I've heard from many people that the Taliban use to have long hair themselves in Kabul. Especially the ones who were involved in fighting.

With regards to Deobandis, they believe men's hair should be of equal length. According to Hanafi Madhab, men should eithe let their hair grow equally long until their shoulders or cut it short/shave it bald. But never unequal length.

I believe this also the opinion of other jurists. I am not sure though.

I follow same opinion. I either let it grow long or keep it really short.

[Samandri]

My relatives from Kabul told me they didn't ban long hair. They banned those European style hairstyle where part of the hair is cut short and other parts left to grow longer making the hair look funny. Especially in early 90's many Afghans in Kabul use to have these silly hairstyles which offended religious people. It was considered as a sign of immorality.

I've heard from many people that the Taliban use to have long hair themselves in Kabul. Especially the ones who were involved in fighting.

With regards to Deobandis, they believe men's hair should be of equal length. According to Hanafi Madhab, men should eithe let their hair grow equally long until their shoulders or cut it short/shave it bald. But never unequal length.

I believe this also the opinion of other jurists. I am not sure though.

I follow same opinion. I either let it grow long or keep it really short.

That must have been the case.

Even though Prophet shaved his head on some specific occasions like Umrah, Hajj, and has not recommended it all the times it yet many Deobandi mullahs stay shaved-head, thinking it is a Sunnah. Is'nt it a Bid'ah?