NATO should now leave afghanistan: Pakistani media

[Gulbabo]

why can't pakistan mind its own business?

[Nokia_Apridy]

GB zka chay Afghanistan Ma plar awo Pakistan ma mor da...

[Gulbabo]

GB zka chay Afghanistan Ma plar awo Pakistan ma mor da...

astaghfirullah... wos ba me yaw tsa wayali wa, sta mor (pakistan) pa bara kei. bas no preda, zma khola ma khlasawa...

yawa khabara chei kawe 1000 wari per fikir woka ... da hokhyarano dagha nakha wei!

[Nokia_Apridy]

Gulbabo walay ?.......Astagfar walay.........sa darogh khu na wayam....

ta da khpalay mor na Enkar kwalay shay ?...

[PakiPathan]

Khyal and pir rokhan want farangi occupation of FATA....astaghfirullah...qayamat ar nizdo sho

Dalta kho gwary da Punjabyano deray wofadaray chamchey kaar kawee. LOL

[Nick]

All those who watch Pakistani tv channels might have seen that Pakistani establishment has launched a campaign through these channels that since Osama bin Laden is dead, NATO forces should immediately leave afghanistan now. The chorus is sung by Dawn news tv, Geo tv, Express tv, Dunya tv, Waqt tv, Aaj tv, Express tv etc. Pakistan still seems to be more interested in retaining its control over afghanistan than relinquishing its support for regional terrorism, a tool which it has so far used for extending its hegemonic agenda.

No they just BS after all Iran always BS about US and Israel and yet nothing happened lol this is just ISI media properganda to win some hearts. The ISI know Americans will not do that as far as I know fro0m economical point of view PK is far better than it was 10 years ago all due to USA foreign aid as well as economy of Afghanistan which depand on Pakistani imports and all of these contracts were given to these Pakistanis thanks to USA.
This is just a BS .

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Everything is relative. What I said might sound sensical if you think by considering Afghanistan as the axis of interests instead of Pakistan as the nucleus of Islam and its army as the incharge. Coming to your points, I would opine that:

1- Do you think that by being asked by NATO the Paki forces would terminate their strategic assets which they are hiding in FATA [like UBL was being given protection right under their ass near PMA Kakool] to justify the killing of Pashtuns there and to infiltrate into Afghanistan...I would say it would be politically naive to think this about Pakis.

2- How can ANP or PKMAP or even other political parties do any political work when the Punjabi empire has made FATA a no man's land for civilians and fort of Islam against Muslim Afghanistan for the army? Neither the political parties nor the media is given access by the military to FATA.

3- I agree with what you proposed to destablise Pakistan [hence stabilise the region] however I differ in the methodology. We have to free ourselves as well as the Pashtun cheerleaders and slaves of Punjab from the clutches of tyrrany. It was in the pursuance of this same goal that we need to win the sympathies of the international community [represented by UN] so it could play their role in stopping the bloodshed of Pashtuns and Balochis. Seeking the sympathies of int’l community does not negate indigenous struggle to challenge the atrocities of a terrorist state like Pakistan. Any student of political science would agree that you cannot challenge a state with arms but by protests organised by a party which uses passive or active resistence as a tool for revolutionary struggle.

1. Why should they terminate an assett? Mr. Bin Ladin had legitimate gripes with the United States, plain and simple. It is the US's moral job to quit messing around in people's countries and propping up dictators to create these assetts in the first place. Its not their job or their duty to terminate anyone of any sort with a legitimate grievance. The only presence that should be terminated is that of an illegitimate Christian forces that are occupying neighboring Afghanistan. Beyond that, Pakistan should terminate its military presence from FATA. Hakimullah Mehsud is far more representative of the Mehsuds than are Farhat Taj and any PMAPers.

2. Afghanistan's government is a government that is attempting forced secularization. It is also propped up by the fiat and force of an occupier. It is illegitimate no matter how you attempt to justify it. The urban, effeminate elite that fled the Russian invasion for the safety and real mansions of the West (in contrast to the supposed mansion of Mr. Bin Ladin) deserve no role in Afghanistan's governance.

3. the UN never leaves once it comes in. I can refer you to Africa and to the Balkans as an example. The UN is basically, as the Libya conflict is proving, the US and its firepower. The remainder of the powers have not even enough bombs to execute its declared war on the Libyans without the US taking the lead:

http://www.frumforum.com/nato-running-short-of-bombs

You have no proof whatsoever that the locals would take well or desire the presence of non Muslim secular occupying forces on their land.

I will reiterate, it is your, Khyaals, and Toraman's duty to utilize force, not NATOs or any simple American who has no reason to execute nationalist agendas for such parties as ANP and PMAP.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

The reason is simple. It was your ISI which provided safe haven to the Al Qaeda terrorists in FATA. These Al Qaeda terrorists slayed all those Pashtun(afghan) elders who rose against them. So it was obligatory for Paki security forces get Pashtun rid of the evil who were the official guests of your master, the ISI. But they are still letting them stay there thus keeping the local population hostage to the ISI-Al Qaeda nexus. Pakis agenda is obvious, to keep Afghanistan perpetually destabilized through Paki Proxies whom you call as Paki sponsord mujahideen.



LOL. This is ridiculous! The people of FATA have already been subjugated since Pakistan's occupation of Afghan land. But after the arrival of NATO led ISAF forces the people of FATA have been handed over to a more vicious Pakistan's ISI sponsored Al Qaeda terrrorists.



I don't know which world your are living in. The Azad Qabayel are no more Azad. The area(middle Pakhtunkhwa) which was previously controlled by Paki Political Agents who used to be the demigods, the Viceroy of the people of FATA have been replaced by ISI sponsored Al Qaeda terrorists.
The security personnels who are being killed in FATA are no other than Pashtun Khasadars and Para Military men.

The apparent clashes is just a hoax to dupe the world of a conflict between Al Qaeada and Paki Security forces which is not the case, and the long stay of Osama in comfortable mansion in Abbotabad is a sufficient proof of that.

Wrong. As usual, you confabulate again and again. I will not waste time on the majority of your conspiracy mongering as pretty much all of us have gotten used to you seeing the ISI demon in your breakfast cereal, right between the Lucky Charms and the Honey Nut Cheerios.

I will deal with one claim, and one claim alone, the rest will cost you for time you waste:

YouTube - In Pakistan, a Mix of Anger, Embarrassment Over Bin Laden Raid

This is Gwen Eiffel's PBS news program that Toramana had posted. Go to 3 minutes and 40 seconds into the program. The exact commentary is as follows regarding the "mansion":

"It is not a grande structure and has no signs of luxury."

Now, the US is having to adjust the narrative and admit that he had his gun right near him:

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapc...ex.html?hpt=T1

"Sen. Dianne Feinstein, chairwoman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, told CNN that weapons were near bin Laden, who died on an upper floor of the compound toward the end of the nearly 40-minute raid. "He was right there and going to get those arms. You really can't take a chance."

This has forced the media to return to calling the edifice a compound.

Your attempts to paint an insurgent leader as some pansy Karzai style cashew eating coward only does a disservice to your own cause. As I noted to you, only losers see the world as they want it to be, and not as it is. That is why you will continue to spew PMAP rhetoric fed to you by fat cat, nonmeritocratic, murderous leaders like Mr. Achekzai.

Regarding the apparent clashes with Paki forces.... prove it. The burden of proof is on you for your conspiracy mongering. Otherwise, you remain as irrelevent as you always have.

[khyaal]

Wrong. As usual, you confabulate again and again. I will not waste time on the majority of your conspiracy mongering as pretty much all of us have gotten used to you seeing the ISI demon in your breakfast cereal, right between the Lucky Charms and the Honey Nut Cheerios.

I will deal with one claim, and one claim alone, the rest will cost you for time you waste:

YouTube - In Pakistan, a Mix of Anger, Embarrassment Over Bin Laden Raid

This is Gwen Eiffel's PBS news program that Toramana had posted. Go to 3 minutes and 40 seconds into the program. The exact commentary is as follows regarding the "mansion":

"It is not a grande structure and has no signs of luxury."

Now, the US is having to adjust the narrative and admit that he had his gun right near him:

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapc...ex.html?hpt=T1

"Sen. Dianne Feinstein, chairwoman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, told CNN that weapons were near bin Laden, who died on an upper floor of the compound toward the end of the nearly 40-minute raid. "He was right there and going to get those arms. You really can't take a chance."

This has forced the media to return to calling the edifice a compound.

Your attempts to paint an insurgent leader as some pansy Karzai style cashew eating coward only does a disservice to your own cause. As I noted to you, only losers see the world as they want it to be, and not as it is. That is why you will continue to spew PMAP rhetoric fed to you by fat cat, nonmeritocratic, murderous leaders like Mr. Achekzai.

Regarding the apparent clashes with Paki forces.... prove it. The burden of proof is on you for your conspiracy mongering. Otherwise, you remain as irrelevent as you always have.

Listen Barazai(which I highly doubt you are)! Youtube videos and relying on second hand sources won't fool those who are here on the ground. You are sitting in the US and just speculationg about the situtation of Afghanistan, Pakhtunkhwa and FATA and the root causes of terrorism. Come here, each and every sane Pashtun afghan will tell you who is behind terrorism in the region.

BTW, why are you playing the role of Punjabi-ISI apologist here while at the same time claiming descendence of Afghan Abdal? You are really a shady character. LOL

[ghundal]

Here maybe you need to hear it properly.

Osama was allegedly found in Pakistan, right near Islamabad.

He was not allegedly found in Afghanistan, not in Kabul, not in Kandahar , not anywhere. Now quit supporting foreign intervention against Muslims who ANP-PMAP refuse to fight because they lack guts. All Afghans are opposed to foreign presence (from all US reported polls)

There are no terrrorists in Pashtun lands. You are playing along the Pakistan-US agenda which has miserably FAILED LOL

[khyaal]

Here maybe you need to hear it properly.

Osama was allegedly found in Pakistan, right near Islamabad.

He was not allegedly found in Afghanistan, not in Kabul, not in Kandahar , not anywhere. Now quit supporting foreign intervention against Muslims who ANP-PMAP refuse to fight because they lack guts. All Afghans are opposed to foreign presence (from all US reported polls)

There are no terrrorists in Pashtun lands. You are playing along the Pakistan-US agenda which has miserably FAILED LOL

OK. Answer me. Do you consider Pakhtunkhwa as the historic Afghan land which has been occupied by Pakistan?

Do you consider Pakistan's intervention in Afghanistan as foreign intervention?

[BarakzaiAbdali]

OK. Answer me. Do you consider Pakhtunkhwa as the historic Afghan land which has been occupied by Pakistan?

Do you consider Pakistan's intervention in Afghanistan as foreign intervention?

The answers are simple: Yes and a resounding yes.

The issue, or where we differ, and where I find common ground with Ghaznavi, another Afghan you have accused of being an ISI lacky or a Panjaby, is how one deals with that particular threat. The other question for us all is what is what particular governance is more reflective of the people and interferes as little in their lives as possible and allows them to be nearer to their indigenous practices.

What this distills down to is that you conflate two things. For instance, Islamabad supported both Abdul Rasul Sayyaf and the Taliban simultaneously.... yet Sayyaf fought against the Taliban. Pakistan appeared diametrically opposed to the Northern Alliance. Iran and India on the other hand supported the United Front/NA. Pakistan decided to, for its strategic depth, support the party that it had the most affinity to and the party that appeared to be gaining an upper hand. Recall that Pakistan also supported Hekmetyaar, who fought the Taliban until they aligned together for the current defensive jihaad. That however, doesnt negate or address how close these movements were to the indigenous culture. The two are mutually exclusive concepts. For instance, the US funded the Afghan Russian War and utilized madrassah students, but that doesnt by any stretch of the imagination mean that the US is an Islamic nation. Your inability to separate the two concepts renders you ineffective as a debater.

However, I refer you to Shayesta's article that she obviously had not read in full, by the esteemed Dr. Kakar, a critic of the Taliban, and a well known historian of the Russo Afghan experience. Its single quote devastates your logic, devastates your world view, and shakes up the roots of your ridiculous conclusion that a white guy from Texas somehow will look out for Pashtun interests above other Pashtuns. It renders obsolete your idiocy about how that some white guy from America with a machine gun will somehow restore pure Pashtun culture:

http://www.institute-for-afghan-stud...ntro_kakar.htm

It is validating what I have always said regarding the presence of the Talib. It also validates what the Tribal Analysis Center was arguing and is now, thanks to you, an independent source that Toramana was asking for regarding the careful work that TAC puts into its presentations.

"Although taliban have never been, until recent times, at the pinnacle of military and political power, they are not new to Afghanistan. They have been a component of the religious establishment and have always ways lived in the shadow of other military, political, and economic groups. Mullah Shor Bazar, an Afghan fighter known for inflicting heavy losses on the British during the Third Anglo-Afghan war of 1919, was also a talib, as were Mirwais Khan Hotaki, and Mullah Mushki Alam, who fought against the British occupation of Afghanistan. During the national struggle against the Soviet invaders, taliban fought alongside the Mujahideen mainly under the leadership of Mohammad Nabi, one of the seven sanctioned Mujahideen leaders in Pakistan (also known as "Peshawar Tanzeem" Leaders)."

Finally, the KICKER:

"In reality, the traditional way of life in villages has changed little by Taliban's rule. The situation of Afghans in the countryside controlled by the Taliban has improved because of increased peace and security, giving them the opportunity to rebuild after two decades of war."

Deal with the evidence Khyaal, deal with the quote, deal with reality.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Listen Barazai(which I highly doubt you are)! Youtube videos and relying on second hand sources won't fool those who are here on the ground. You are sitting in the US and just speculationg about the situtation of Afghanistan, Pakhtunkhwa and FATA and the root causes of terrorism. Come here, each and every sane Pashtun afghan will tell you who is behind terrorism in the region.

BTW, why are you playing the role of Punjabi-ISI apologist here while at the same time claiming descendence of Afghan Abdal? You are really a shady character. LOL

lol, oh Khyaal, here is where you go so rabid that reality starts to spin around you like a Jew spins the dredle during Hannukaah. The video is not a random Youtube video, its from the American Public Broadcasting Station... not ISI lackeys incorporated (aka Mr. Achekzai who murdered an Afghan tribal chief and is an avowed Marxist). Deal with the reality. Moreover, it was your colleague and supporter Toramana that posted the video and he has also posted a schematic of the complex.

Furthermore, by sitting in the US, I automatically trump you because I have lived here and yet I have traveled there. We have far more information access than any nation before us and any nation in existence. This simply means that I have seen more of the world than you and continue to be able to do so. So you cannot fool any of us that have seen homes in south and central asia and have spent time there. Your, "you are in America" ruse is useless here. This was by no means a luxury mansion, no matter how far you stretch your imagination, which appears limitless when it comes to seeing ISI around every corner and hiding under your fingernails lol.

Deal with the video and its statement. Either prove the lady is an ISI agent, or quit while you are not too far behind.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

By the way Khyaal, what do you think about these ISI agents?:

http://english.aljazeera.net/video/a...315358960.html

Loooooool. See Khyaal, you are brainwashed beyond belief. You have no idea about how you are advocating the killing of your own people where my blood hails from. You have little idea at all about how the man on the ground feels. Let me guess, Al Jazeera is also an ISI vehicle or .... wait for it, wait for it, wait for it... its the Saudi regime's way of propagandizing for wahhabi influence and they recruited these people from the Panjab and put them all in Sorabaay.

Deal with the video. Note that the newsman makes it clear that Kabulites are the urban elite and that the rural masses see Mr. Bin Ladin entirely differently.