How do we deal with Smarty-a traitor to our nation?

[tilla_jogian]

Smarty is banya, aka merchant class lohani. He own plots in Rawalpindi. Cunningness comes naturally to them.

[tilla_jogian]

I think by posting that message from Smarty aka Goofy, DZJ wanted to expose him - In my opinion she found a nice way to post what Goofy really says in private contrary to what he pretends here.

And like I said before, the he is even worst than we thought before as indicated by his statement when he says "a person of my background ....". In other words, he wants to say as long as Pakistan is paying my family I can't be against Pakistan even if I want to.

Most Pakistanis support Pakistan for similar reasons. People think for family well being first before ethnic/race. Why do you think afghanis don't even leave punjab which is supposed to be your enemy number 1?

The first reason they will give for not leaving will be that they don't know anything about Afghanistan.

[Toramana]

Most Pakistanis support Pakistan for similar reasons. People think for family well being first before ethnic/race. Why do you think afghanis don't even leave punjab which is supposed to be your enemy number 1?

The first reason they will give for not leaving will be that they don't know anything about Afghanistan.

Afghans in Punjab are facing the same dilemma as Pakis and Muslims in the West, i.e., they have been living there for at least one generation and now starting life anew at another place even if that is the country of origin is a difficult task.

As for people thinking about family well-being first, may be few but not all. Even if majority of people place family before ideology it doesn't mean the benefit of such a thinking accrues to all.

Just imagine how prosperous Baluchis could become if they re-gained control of their land and resources and how poor Punjab would become if they lost control of the resources and land of other people.

In the present set up few tribal chiefs are bribed by the Punjab in return for surrendering the control of Baluch resources and land.

Same is the status and role of Smarty like people.

80% army is Punjabi and even in the form of pays, perks, and privileges, Punjabis are taking the lion share out of the common pool.

[tripledouble]

Afghans in Punjab are facing the same dilemma as Pakis and Muslims in the West, i.e., they have been living there for at least one generation and now starting life anew at another place even if that is the country of origin is a difficult task.

As for people thinking about family well-being first, may be few but not all. Even if majority of people place family before ideology it doesn't mean the benefit of such a thinking accrues to all.

Just imagine how prosperous Baluchis could become if they re-gained control of their land and resources and how poor Punjab would become if they lost control of the resources and land of other people.

Punjab can not be poor, even in india, punjab despite being small state divided by indians, it is still one of richest states in india because of it's fertile agriculutural feilds, it's like Prairies in Canada or midwest in umreeka

Punjab was invaded historically for this reason, it provided breadbasket to afghans

[Toramana]

Punjab can not be poor, even in india, punjab despite being small state divided by indians, it is still one of richest states in india because of it's fertile agriculutural feilds, it's like Prairies in Canada or midwest in umreeka

Punjab was invaded historically for this reason, it provided breadbasket to afghans

Land and agricultural productivity was something that people fought over in ancient times but land is no longer the main sources of prosperity in modern economy. They are some other things like coastline, strategic location, trade routes, mineral resources, energy generating potential, etc.

Of all the provinces, Punjab is the most vulnerable because in terms of economy, geographical location, lack of natural resources except land, water problem (it is lower riparian), etc., it is not having strong standings.

Without the other provinces it will be impossible to prevent its receding back into Indian political and cultural milieu. And I think within a few generation Punjab may reconvert to Sikhism most likely because that will culturally be the most viable course in the long run.

[tilla_jogian]

Afghans in Punjab are facing the same dilemma as Pakis and Muslims in the West, i.e., they have been living there for at least one generation and now starting life anew at another place even if that is the country of origin is a difficult task.

As for people thinking about family well-being first, may be few but not all. Even if majority of people place family before ideology it doesn't mean the benefit of such a thinking accrues to all.

Just imagine how prosperous Baluchis could become if they re-gained control of their land and resources and how poor Punjab would become if they lost control of the resources and land of other people.

In the present set up few tribal chiefs are bribed by the Punjab in return for surrendering the control of Baluch resources and land.

Same is the status and role of Smarty like people.

80% army is Punjabi and even in the form of pays, perks, and privileges, Punjabis are taking the lion share out of the common pool.

Afghanis don't face that dilemma, they can easily move back to Afghanistan.

lol at "resources". Punjab is facing most of shortages, the resources are pitfull anywhere in Pakistan.

Pakistan is desperate to import gas, coal, electricity etc What resources are you talking about? 70% of of Pak gas is produced in Sindh and they take care of themselves before thinking about punjab.

Baloch couldn't be any more prosperous because even in Punjab most rich people used to be sheikh aka historical merchant class or banya. Only now other people are catching up to them in education, business etc There is no merchant class in Baluchistan like there is one in punjab. Few centuries back merchant class was below zamindar but things are different now.

Why are sindhis backward? Because before partition there used to be sindhi merchant class in Sindh, who were 90% hindus unlike in punjab where things were more even. Muslim sindhis were mostly slaves of waderas, not independent enough.

Thats why sindhis are so backward in Pakistan compared to muhajirs while in India sindhi is synonyms with rich and powerful despite being few million. And unlike punjabis of non-merchant background, sindhi muslims have stayed where they were before 1947 and depend on quota system to compete with others.

Pakistani pashtuns are also well off compared to sindhis and baloch because of people like smarty who belong to banya class.

Same is the case with punjabi khatris in India, despite just few million population they have made name for themselves just like sindhi hindus.

[tripledouble]

Land and agricultural productivity was something that people fought over in ancient times but land is no longer the main sources of prosperity in modern economy. They are some other things like coastline, strategic location, trade routes, mineral resources, energy generating potential, etc.

Of all the provinces, Punjab is the most vulnerable because in terms of economy, geographical location, lack of natural resources except land, water problem (it is lower riparian), etc., it is not having strong standings.

Without the other provinces it will be impossible to prevent its receding back into Indian political and cultural milieu. And I think within a few generation Punjab may reconvert to Sikhism most likely because that will culturally be the most viable course in the long run.

no i think punjabis & sikhs would rather break india than stay with india, & i don't balkanization will happen atleast for another 50-100 years; why would punjabi musalmans convert to sikhism when sikhs are becoming atheists themselves?
i think best choice is for punjab to become province of sindh like in history

[Toramana]

Afghanis don't face that dilemma, they can easily move back to Afghanistan.

lol at "resources". Punjab is facing most of shortages, the resources are pitfull anywhere in Pakistan.

Pakistan is desperate to import gas, coal, electricity etc What resources are you talking about? 70% of of Pak gas is produced in Sindh and they take care of themselves before thinking about punjab.

Baloch couldn't be any more prosperous because even in Punjab most rich people used to be sheikh aka historical merchant class or banya. Only now other people are catching up to them in education, business etc There is no merchant class in Baluchistan like there is one in punjab. Few centuries back merchant class was below zamindar but things are different now.

Why are sindhis backward? Because before partition there used to be sindhi merchant class in Sindh, who were 90% hindus unlike in punjab where things were more even. Muslim sindhis were mostly slaves of waderas, not independent enough.

Thats why sindhis are so backward in Pakistan compared to muhajirs while in India sindhi is synonyms with rich and powerful despite being few million. And unlike punjabis of non-merchant background, sindhi muslims have stayed where they were before 1947 and depend on quota system to compete with others.

Pakistani pashtuns are also well off compared to sindhis and baloch because of people like smarty who belong to banya class.

Same is the case with punjabi khatris in India, despite just few million population they have made name for themselves just like sindhi hindus.

On Smarty I agree that he belongs to the Banya class. lol.

[tilla_jogian]

Land and agricultural productivity was something that people fought over in ancient times but land is no longer the main sources of prosperity in modern economy. They are some other things like coastline, strategic location, trade routes, mineral resources, energy generating potential, etc.

Of all the provinces, Punjab is the most vulnerable because in terms of economy, geographical location, lack of natural resources except land, water problem (it is lower riparian), etc., it is not having strong standings.

Without the other provinces it will be impossible to prevent its receding back into Indian political and cultural milieu. And I think within a few generation Punjab may reconvert to Sikhism most likely because that will culturally be the most viable course in the long run.

did you provide services to some sikhs? You are in love with them. Afghanistan is land locked, Pakistan at least have Gwader. Remember Pakistan own Gwader it will be part of successor state even if country gets broken. And forget about us converting to your sikhsm and joining bharat paa jee.

[Toramana]

no i think punjabis & sikhs would rather break india than stay with india, & i don't balkanization will happen atleast for another 50-100 years; why would punjabi musalmans convert to sikhism when sikhs are becoming atheists themselves?
i think best choice is for punjab to become province of sindh like in history

Yes if other global powers want to break up India into many pieces and if India didn't have the power to foil that. But it sounds to me a unified India as long as it could be a source of balance of power in Asia (to keep other powers like China in check) will be favoured rather.

Sikhs are deeply religious. Widespread atheism in Sikhs is impossible.

Yes, federation with Sindh will be a likely scenario but the one in which Sindh will have the upper hand.

[Toramana]

did you provide services to some sikhs? You are in love with them. Afghanistan is land locked, Pakistan at least have Gwader. Remember Pakistan own Gwader it will be part of successor state even if country gets broken. And forget about us converting to your sikhsm and joining bharat paa jee.

There are far more voracious animals rambling the grounds. I don't think most of the powers will like the port to go to the successor state. Neither the Baluch will let go.

As for Afghanistan, it is true it is landlocked but it is kind of a land-port connecting so many important regions. Besides, it is naturally fortified.

[tilla_jogian]

Yes if other global powers want to break up India into many pieces and if India didn't have the power to foil that. But it sounds to me a unified India as long as it could be a source of balance of power in Asia (to keep other powers like China in check) will be favoured rather.

Sikhs are deeply religious. Widespread atheism in Sikhs is impossible.

Yes, federation with Sindh will be a likely scenario but the one in which Sindh will have the upper hand.

Bhai we don't like upper hand of anyone on us (don't know about you), we will get to sea by hook or croock. Gwader and Karachi are our cities.

[tilla_jogian]

There are far more voracious animals rambling the grounds. I don't think most of the powers will like the port to go to the successor state. Neither the Baluch will let go.

As for Afghanistan, it is true it is landlocked but it is kind of a land-port connecting so many important regions. Besides, it is naturally fortified.

As I said Gwader is owned by Pakistan. Do you get it? Do you want me to post some examples from world? Do you know about Islamabad? Its federal city and will go to successor state if country is broken. Same is the case with Gwader, got it?

If tomorrow punjabis want to join their sikh brethren according to your fantasy, it means they will have to renounce Islamabad and Gwader.

[Toramana]

Bhai we don't like upper hand of anyone on us (don't know about you), we will get to sea by hook or croock. Gwader and Karachi are our cities.

Then you would be facing a situation like Serbia with B-52 etc. blasting the nuclear tunnel, international court of justice ordering to chop off heads for crimes against humanity, etc. We are living in a complex world now with many voracious animals watching the preying grounds.

Baluch, Sindhis, and Urdu speakers wouldn't be just lame-ducks watching you to grab Karachi and Gawadar. Even Arab Shiekhs and Iranians wouldn't like that.

Just recall what happened in 1971.

[tilla_jogian]

Then you would be facing a situation like Serbia with B-52 etc. blasting the nuclear tunnel, international court of justice ordering to chop off heads for crimes against humanity, etc. We are living in a complex world now with many voracious animals watching the preying grounds.

Baluch, Sindhis, and Urdu speakers wouldn't be just lame-ducks watching you to grab Karachi and Gawadar. Even Arab Shiekhs and Iranians wouldn't like that.

Just recall what happened in 1971.

Before that happens Pakistan will invent excuse to bomb Afghanis, may even use nukes on Afghanis to put them out of their misery. To me this sound more likely then any off your predictions so far. Most people will agree with me on this.

After that there will be caos for limited time, nothing which modern military can't take care off especially with backing of future super power China behind you. They will want Pakistan to be intact because of Gwader. Remember how before zarb azb this operation was supposed to end Pakistan? Pakistan have only gained strength and become more powrful lol