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Default Pakistan, History, Politics & Policies: Removing some common misconceptions - 04-18-2010, 03:32 AM

Pakistan, History, Politics & Policies: Removing some common misconceptions

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INTRO
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I am just your ordinary Pakistani Pushtun. I always wanted to be at a site like this where we have all our Pushtun Brothers and sisters, from Pakistan, Afghanistan and from all over the world. Our history is very rich. We are a proud people. We have never been conquered by anyone. No matter where we are or whatever happens, we feel a common bond.

We are Muslims and with the troubled past and present are citizens of different countries, whether here or abroad. Yet, besides all our other allegiances, like the common Muslim bond of brotherhood, we also have Pushtunwali.

Pushtunwali is ancient, they say it is descended from the Torah. It is this commonality that has persevered. You might have liberal minded Western Pushtuns, conservative watanwal Pushtuns or just common ones like myself but no matter what the belief and ideas, one thing is common to all of them. Being Pushtun.


Why the thread?
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After I joined this forum, I found that everyone here was kind and brotherly to me, even when we differed. I like this sense of brotherhood. It tells me we are one blood, one nation, one DNA.

Yet there are many things, the reaction to which of my fellow Pushtun brothers and sisters was something I found strange.

I never realized that simple things like my avatar could be so offensive to some of our brothers and sister here. This is strange and alien for me. There are many thins and issues besides this as well.

Though from school times to the University and also in everyday life, I have had extensive interaction with my fellow Pukhtuns, both elder and young, local and foreign, Pakistani and Afghani.

So I am making this thread, to let all of you brothers and sisters know, our line of thought, or looking at things, our views and concepts. By ours I mean Pakistani Pushtuns. I can safely say this represents the Pushtuns in Khyber Pukhtunkhwa only.


The Pattern
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Every timethere is an issue that is a reason for conflict between us here, we shall discuss it. Why it seems normal to some of us, and offensive to others.


What do we gain

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We learn from each other.
We realize our differences and over come them.
There are no off limit issues between us.
We turn our differences into our strength and bonds.


And besides others, most importantly, we learn new lines of thought and ideas that were previously un achievable.

Last edited by Khushal Khan Khattak; 04-18-2010 at 03:35 AM.
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Khushal Khan Khattak
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Smile 04-18-2010, 03:33 AM

To participate,

please read the above written post.


Dera manana.
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Khushal Khan Khattak
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Smile 04-18-2010, 03:44 AM

I'll start with the following:

why does Pakistan name its weapons after Afghan Heroes?

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Why
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Note: This is my point of view, meaning, this is the point of view, I have been brought up with and what I have learned myself from study or research as a Pakistani Pushtun.


1) There is a great multitude of Afghans (Pushtuns) in Pakistan.

2) The heroes are common heroes between Afghans and the other nationalities of Pakistan like Punjabis, Sindhis etc.

3) These heroes are taught about in our schools and greatly respected.

4) Pakistanis (whether Afghan or Punjabi or others) consider them as common heroes even though they were ethnic Pushutn/Afghan.

5) These heroes served to liberate India from the Hindu Emperors and rulers and so are respected for their service to Islam.

6) They in addition to being part of the great Afghan/Pushtun hsitory are also part of the glorious history of Muslims and the Muslims of India in specific.

7) A great number of us Afghans serve in the Pakistan military and agencies, including many scientists and engineers. They have some part in it as well.

8) Our arch rival is India. In history our heroes (these very Afghan Heroes) defeated the heroes that the Hindus revered. Naming these weapons after them serves this purpose as well.



Last edited by Khushal Khan Khattak; 04-18-2010 at 06:52 AM.
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Default 04-18-2010, 05:16 AM

Why do you assume that it is only Afghanistan pashtuns? The reality is that here and a lot of other forums (and orgs) by the way it is Pashtunkhwa pashtuns who don't understand your "line of thinking". I don't know why you don't mention that part. What are you trying to justify as well (the opinion that is shown/exemplified by that contradiction of a display pic/avatar)?
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Default 04-18-2010, 05:31 AM

Good idea khushal but this is just going to turn into a flame thread, if you had compared pakistanis to nazis and punjabis to gestapo then a lot of members here would join you but any attempt like this is just going to earn you bashing


It's enough that I know, Our time had a home, In your heart..Was a place..But the glass always breaks..
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Post 04-18-2010, 05:35 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BLS_1919v2.0 View Post
Why do you assume that it is only Afghanistan pashtuns? The reality is that here and a lot of other forums (and orgs) by the way it is Pashtunkhwa pashtuns who don't understand your "line of thinking". I don't know why you don't mention that part. What are you trying to justify as well (the opinion that is shown/exemplified by that contradiction of a display pic/avatar)?
Actually, I do understand that Pukhtunkhwa Pushtuns also feel this way.

However I also understand that these Pushtuns are of two types:

1) Belonging to ANP
2) From FATA areas.

In the first case it is understandable because they are Nationalists. Although, I have and my family have voted for them from time to time but I am not a big supporter of them because of a few of their agendas.

In the latter case, I know that this anti Pakistan sentiment has grown after the Army operations and Drone attacks.

NOTE: I am not here to defend every policy and action of Pakistan or its Army. I am with the state not with Governments or its armed organizations. These groups have undoubtedly committed acts which I dont approve. For example: the bombing recently ( previous week) that killed 120 people. The Army has acknowledged they were civilians (some of them). However, I condemn all of it. I demand that whoever made the error be brought to justice. Swift and terrible justice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BLS_1919v2.0 View Post
by the way it is Pashtunkhwa pashtuns who don't understand your "line of thinking".
From my personal experience, I am advanced in years enough and have traveled enough in Pukhtunkhwa, to tell you that such Pushtuns represent a minority.

They are very few. Whether this is a good or bad thing, the reality is, if a cause does not have numbers (of people) behind it, that cause will not succeed.

At best I'd say such mindset is present in some 5 percent people only.

ANP won the elections not because of Pushtun Nationality but because everyone was fed up with MMA.
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Smile 04-18-2010, 05:39 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Talal View Post
Good idea khushal but this is just going to turn into a flame thread, if you had compared pakistanis to nazis and punjabis to gestapo then a lot of members here would join you but any attempt like this is just going to earn you bashing

I dont think so Mr. Talal, and here is why:

even though guys like BLS might not agree with me, BOTH BLS and myself recognize and agree on the fact that in the end we are both Afghans (Pushtuns). In the end, it only this that matters.

He might not agree with me BUT I KNOW IF I NEED HIM, HE WILL DIE FOR ME, AND I WILL CERTAINLY WITHOUT THINKING DIE FOR HIM.

THIS IS PUSHTUNWALI,
(something the world including Goraaz/Speeniaan cannot understand)
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Default 04-18-2010, 05:40 AM

I am not a fan of ANP, although I respect Bacha Khan. I think the number will increase as the situation has worsened. At the end of the day it is not so much the cause as is the present structure of the state. Yugoslavia kae ham nationalism domraa zyaath na woo kho che state raa math shu nu bya haalath badl shulal...zamaa pa nazar da kam policy che ghq raa makhae tha karrae dae ao kaee ao pakhtaana warna thabaa shu dagh da laasa pakistan khpl maathaedo laara jorr karrae da. Sirf pakhtaana ham na kho baloch ham. Ka rekhtiya owaema zamaa tha da jeeva jeevae pakhtaana pa dae dder badh lagee che pakhtaana swazee ao dyuu da nuru saraa odhraegee...ao bya che mung tsa owaayuu nu waee "its pashtuns fault, they should have been smarter.." or "its a zionist conspiracy, hanud wa yahud..etc". Yaw tharf na paighour ao bya dukhman saraa odhraegee.
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Default 04-18-2010, 05:42 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Khushal Khan Khattak View Post
I dont think so Mr. Talal, and here is why:

even though guys like BLS might not agree with me, BOTH BLS and myself recognize and agree on the fact that in the end we are both Afghans (Pushtuns). In the end, it only this that matters.

He might not agree with me BUT I KNOW IF I NEED HIM, HE WILL DIE FOR ME, AND I WILL CERTAINLY WITHOUT THINKING DIE FOR HIM.

THIS IS PUSHTUNWALI,
(something the world including Goraaz/Speeniaan cannot understand)
That is exactly what I want from Pashtuns on either side of the durand line. I want them to understand that now we are being humiliated and sidelined...they need to do what Pashtuns call Dddalaa. In principle I am not against a state like pakistan, I just don't like the fact that east or west of the durand we suffer. And then we let them go scot free, I don't like this idea.
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Unhappy 04-18-2010, 05:56 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BLS_1919v2.0 View Post
That is exactly what I want from Pashtuns on either side of the durand line.
As do I brother. But I think this is present in every Pushtun's blood, and if it isnt then I dont consider him a Pushtun. Certainly if I didnt feel this way I would not call myself a Pushtun. That would be an insult to Pushtunwali, Pushtuns and Khushal Baba.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BLS_1919v2.0 View Post
In principle I am not against a state like pakistan.
Manana Wrora, this is what I believe, in principle we should not be against the state of Pakistan. But as you said.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by BLS_1919v2.0 View Post
I want them to understand that now we are being humiliated and sidelined...they need to do what Pashtuns call Dddalaa. I just don't like the fact that east or west of the durand we suffer. And then we let them go scot free, I don't like this idea.
especially:

Quote:
Originally Posted by BLS_1919v2.0 View Post
And then we let them go scot free, I don't like this idea.
You only dont like it, I hate it!.

This is the truth:

Pushtuns are suffering
They are suffering on either side if the line.

But even more sad is the fact that, they are not united, they have no voice to represent them, they have no real leaders who will stand and die with their people, and even if they are killed, no one even questions the killers, no one even mentions the crime.

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