View Full Version : Kandahari dialect = Purest Pashto dialect


Aryob
09-14-2010, 10:42 PM
da rakam khabare sirf intishar paida kawi de khalko manz ke.
i hope you are not kandarai supporting kandarai accent cause if you are then you are damaging the whole cause of this forum and unity of Pashtuns.

woor
09-15-2010, 02:30 AM
@shomblay we both fight a war and win against the whole world proving that pakhtuns are the best. and instead of celebrating our win, you tell me that you are better than me. Time to fight again? Just tell you the story of pakhtuns in a nut shell.

Niazi
09-15-2010, 10:39 AM
purest Pashto dialect is found in Kandahar, the cultural heart of the Pashtuns.

Kandahari is the most heavily diluted dailect ,half of kandahari is Farsi that's a fact.,
Stop pushing your silly Kandahrism ,you won't get a nywhere with it ,we are already divided into million Khils and Zai's ,no wonder we get hammered all around.

Son of Mountains
09-15-2010, 11:06 AM
Original Pashto dialect is either from Kandahar or from Koh-e-Suleman

Wrayun
09-22-2010, 05:44 AM
shlombay;

purest Pashto dialect is found in Kandahar, the cultural heart of the Pashtuns.

Nope, sorry to disagree with you but the purest Pukhto is found midst the Karlani group of Pukhtoons who are mostly hill tribes and most use the "KH" dialect. The SH dialect comes from Persian influence. There are many words that starts with KH which don't have substitutes in the SH dialect, and that is how I conclude that the purest dialect is KH. For example Khor (Shor?), Khawra (Shawra?), Khwa (Shwa?), Khalak (Shalak?), Khanda (Shanda?) etc.

Another reason is that Kandahar was the capital in Pukhtoon/Afghan dynasties and the court language back then was exclusively Farsi.

Levanaye Zalmaye
09-22-2010, 06:30 AM
Wrayun, shlombay, woor, Sangar and others.

Greetings.

The "sheen" dialect came before the "kheen" version. There's plenty of evidence for that. Languages evolve and are highly influenced by other languages of the same sub-group. Therefore, it is only natural that the "sheen" dialect (which has many words in common with other surrounding languages) was the original dialect.

As for the 'purest' dialect, it's only natural that since 'kheen' changes a lot of words (shaar/shehar and khaar or shaysta and khaysta or mashaam/shaam and makhaam or shikaar [hunting] and khkaar), you will find very few words that sound similar to words from Persian and Urdu. But that only makes the pronunciation unique and linguistically speaking, the words remain the same.

In our dialect, ts is pronounced as ch and zeem as jeem. So tsalor become chalor (closer to the Urdu chaar), pinza becomes pinja (closer to the Urdu paanch), zah (go) becomes ja (closer to the Urdu jaa), tsarman becomes charman (chamrra), etc. In that sense, the Marwat dialect should be the most impure because it shares words with Indian languages.

However, in written form, all these dialects are almost exactly identical, given that regional vocabulary is not used. Furthermore, the Pashto/Pakhto "tsay" is the equivalent of the sub-continental "chay" as far as linguistics is concerned just like the sheen/kheen alphabet is the equivalent of the Persian sheen.

Nowadays, Pashtuns are borrowing heavily from surrounding languages. In that regard, Kandahari urban Pashto is probably amongst the most diluted forms of Pashto along with the Yousupzai Pekhawar dialect. But the common folk in isolated places such as Mohmand, Bajaur and other surrounding areas tend to use mostly 'authentic' Pashto vocabulary.

Abdul Haq
09-22-2010, 06:50 AM
Kandahari is the most heavily diluted dailect ,half of kandahari is Farsi that's a fact.,
Stop pushing your silly Kandahrism ,you won't get a nywhere with it ,we are already divided into million Khils and Zai's ,no wonder we get hammered all around.

the present kandahar is a part of Loy Kandahar it includes Helmand,Zabul,uruzgan and the now kandahar. there are many dialects in Loy Kandahar. as par as related to todays kandahar, yes, kandahari language is heavily affected by Farsi but however its dialect remains Pure.

Wrayun
09-22-2010, 07:51 AM
Levanaye Zalmaye,

The "sheen" dialect came before the "kheen" version. There's plenty of evidence for that.

For example?

Languages evolve and are highly influenced by other languages of the same sub-group. Therefore, it is only natural that the "sheen" dialect (which has many words in common with other surrounding languages) was the original dialect.

As for the 'purest' dialect, it's only natural that since 'kheen' changes a lot of words (shaar/shehar and khaar or shaysta and khaysta or mashaam/shaam and makhaam or shikaar [hunting] and khkaar), you will find very few words that sound similar to words from Persian and Urdu. But that only makes the pronunciation unique and linguistically speaking, the words remain the same.

In that case what's more likely, Kheen changing into Sheen due to Persian influence, or Sheen changing into Kheen (we need to know what influence that comes from)?

It could very will be that the changes happened the other way around, from kheen to sheen due to Persian influence since Persian was a prevalent language that influenced even Hindi and from that mixture we get Urdu. Thus the similarities.

Another reason I have for this is that modern day Pukhtoons predecessors are always labeled with K, or Kh, like Pactyans, Paktues, and Pakhtas.

Wasn't old Persian and Avestan also of Kh dialect like dokhtar, khvar, khayal...?

Badlun
09-22-2010, 10:16 AM
Discussing dialects TECHNICALLY in the light of Linguistics is good but giving one dialect preference to other is a mistake.

Qandahar is no doubt the only city may be with Jalala Abad where Pashto is the official language and language of education, media, administration , business and courts. In no other city of the world Pashto has this status. In Pakistan Pashto is only spoken almost never written or read.

The differences of KHIN and Shin are based on pure Pashto words not all words containing this sound or letter. For example Khar, khas, khandal etc are the same in both hard and soft dialects because these words are taken form other languages and are not pure Pashto words and are written with Arabic KHE while kha/sha, gira/jira etc are pure Pashto words thats why pronounced differently in the two dialects and written with Pashto khin/khe.

No dialect is superior or inferior , pure or no pure. In Afghanistan Persian is mixed with Pashto and in Pakistan Urdu is mixed. The soultion is using pure Pashto words instead of Urdu or Persian which can be an indivisual choice independent of any dialect.

شمله ور خراساني
09-22-2010, 10:16 AM
poor and pathetic nationalists,

When there is nothing else left, you start bickering among each other proclaiming superiority.

I pitty that poor soul who wastes his life claiming to be somehow superior to another son of adam.


qbpq-Wsafq4

Wrayun
09-22-2010, 10:22 AM
poor and pathetic nationalists,

When there is nothing else left, you start bickering among each other proclaiming superiority.

I pitty that poor soul who wastes his life claiming to be somehow superior to another son of adam.


So Salafis are not better than Sufis? Muslims are not better than Jews, Christians, and Hindus? At least you don't see nationalists calling for each others deaths for disagreeing.


ps, come on, even you have to admit that your above statement is way out league.

Wrayun
09-22-2010, 10:25 AM
Discussing dialects TECHNICALLY in the light of Linguistics is good but giving one dialect preference to other is a mistake.

Qandahar is no doubt the only city may be with Jalala Abad where Pashto is the official language and language of education, media, administration , business and courts. In no other city of the world Pashto has this status. In Pakistan Pashto is only spoken almost never written or read.

The differences of KHIN and Shin are based on pure Pashto words not all words containing this sound or letter. For example Khar, khas, khandal etc are the same in both hard and soft dialects because these words are taken form other languages and are not pure Pashto words and are written with Arabic KHE while kha/sha, gira/jira etc are pure Pashto words thats why pronounced differently in the two dialects and written with Pashto khin/khe.

No dialect is superior or inferior , pure or no pure. In Afghanistan Persian is mixed with Pashto and in Pakistan Urdu is mixed. The soultion is using pure Pashto words instead of Urdu or Persian which can be an indivisual choice independent of any dialect.


I think claiming superiority is wrong, but speaking from historical and linguistic perspective it is good to discuss these issues to have an accurate understanding of our heritage.

Can you tell me which language Khandal and Khar comes from?

Badlun
09-22-2010, 10:32 AM
Can you tell me which language Khandal and Khar comes from?
Persian

Wrayun
09-22-2010, 11:29 AM
Persian

What about words like khor (sister), khog (sweet), kheran (dirty), khwa (side), khpal?

Wrayun
09-22-2010, 11:34 AM
I think obviously that writer who made the claim did some sort of research.

I think its fair to say Kandahar is our major cultural center. Like Osho said its the only Pashtun province/city in the world that used and still used Pashto for everything, sign, talking, reading and writing.

no city of Pakistan can be compared to Kandahar, in Peshawar, Swat Urdu is used. In Jalalabad, Dari is used for provincial level.

only Loy Kandahar strictly used Pashto. Quetta was once part of loy Kandahar and they too once used Pashto like modern day Kandahar but when Punjabis and Baluchis took over they switched everything from Pashto to Urdu.

Do you see the damage now that Pakistan has caused Pashto?

What does Pakistan or Afghanistan have to do with this?