View Full Version : Battle of identities!!


eusuphxai
07-03-2010, 10:32 AM
What am I? a Pakistani? a muslim? a pakhtun? a human being? all of them? none of them? and if i am all of them which order should I use them? Should I even bother to think about it ? is it important to have an identity? and dont tell me you dont care .. we all do.
Chasing these identity have pushed us into deep s***.Our politicians have always used it to convince us to vote for them e.g. MMA got vote to tell people that thier identity is Islam, ANP has always played the card of pukhtun and unfotunatley we have always fallen for it.My question is where is the limit? Should I blindly follow what my identity expect from me? it is in my opinion, the killer of thinking, it makes me a hater , hater of other races, hater of other religions, and hater of everything which is not me. Lets just be pukhtuns (if you are one), or be a Muslim or whatever identity you prefer. and don't show it off. Lets take the good points from our identy and display it on our chest. Lets not fall for this anymore lets not these b**** play with our emotions in the name of our identities. Lets use our identity to our advantage. or lets not have an identity at all, if it is stopping us from progressing.

muhsina
07-03-2010, 10:39 AM
Having an identity is one thing and being exploited by the identity card played by the politicians or clergy or state is another. For example there is nothing wrong in being an Afghan, but to forget your thousands of years identity and adopt a pseudo Pakistani identity for Pashtuns is highly condemnable.

eusuphxai
07-03-2010, 10:54 AM
one word for you PARANOID!! and I can smell it from 1000 miles carry on son, will take you distances

єѕαρχαι
07-03-2010, 10:54 AM
What am I? a Pakistani? a muslim? a pakhtun? a human being? all of them? none of them? and if i am all of them which order should I use them? Should I even bother to think about it ? is it important to have an identity? and dont tell me you dont care .. we all do.
Chasing these identity have pushed us into deep s***.Our politicians have always used it to convince us to vote for them e.g. MMA got vote to tell people that thier identity is Islam, ANP has always played the card of pukhtun and unfotunatley we have always fallen for it.My question is where is the limit? Should I blindly follow what my identity expect from me? it is in my opinion, the killer of thinking, it makes me a hater , hater of other races, hater of other religions, and hater of everything which is not me. Lets just be pukhtuns (if you are one), or be a Muslim or whatever identity you prefer. and don't show it off. Lets take the good points from our identy and display it on our chest. Lets not fall for this anymore lets not these b**** play with our emotions in the name of our identities. Lets use our identity to our advantage. or lets not have an identity at all, if it is stopping us from progressing.

very good point my yousafzai brother. You will find alot of haters in your way , who will do their best to brainwash you. Dont fall for them and preach this message of peace.

Regards

єѕαρχαι
07-03-2010, 10:56 AM
Pakher raghley and welcome to the pashtunforums.

Keep up the good work to enlighten our pashtuns :)

amna.
07-03-2010, 11:11 AM
Welcome here. But just to let you know we Pashtuns are all Afghans.

muhsina
07-03-2010, 11:28 AM
one word for you PARANOID!! and I can smell it from 1000 miles carry on son, will take you distances

So you are one more of the confused nuerotically deactivated clueless retard who does not know whether his argument is being corroborated or refuted.

Helay
07-03-2010, 01:06 PM
Having an identity is one thing and being exploited by the identity card played by the politicians or clergy or state is another. For example there is nothing wrong in being an Afghan, but to forget your thousands of years identity and adopt a pseudo Pakistani identity for Pashtuns is highly condemnable.

haha 1-0 :smile1:

Dreamer
07-03-2010, 01:09 PM
call yourself what ever makes you happy... :)

Son of Mountains
07-03-2010, 03:22 PM
I am a Pakistani since 60 years
I am a Muslim since 1400 years
But I am a Pashtun since 5000 years

muhsina
07-03-2010, 03:32 PM
I am a Pakistani since 60 years
I am a Muslim since 1400 years
But I am a Pashtun since 5000 years

No doubt this is a clear mutation on your part. Keep it up Son [of Mountains].

Toramana
07-03-2010, 03:36 PM
Go for what is the most natural identity and has evoloved from the pragmatic considerations and struggle for survival of our forefatehers. Islamic and Paakki identities are unnatural and fake.

Roshina
07-03-2010, 03:43 PM
As for me, I'm a Pashtun before I'm anything else. It's the most natural thing for me. All my other identities are subject to change any time, but my Pukhtun identity will never change no matter what -- in fact, it'll be passed on to my kids whether anyone likes it or not while all my other identities and labels may not be passed on.

Palwasha
07-03-2010, 05:49 PM
As proud as I am to be Pashtun, and as much as I love my culture and my people, I am a Muslim. My Islam comes before anything and everything. My mother always taught me never to get *too* proud, with anything.

I also greatly dislike this saying: I've been a Pakistani for 60 years, a Muslim for 1400 years, and a Pashtun for thousands of years.

I'm a Muslim, then a Pashtun; Islam should dictate life more than culture. Culture is an influence of life, religion is a way of life.

Many people here will disagree, but we all have our different views and I'm just being honest.

BLS_1919v2.0
07-03-2010, 06:22 PM
So you are one more of the confused nuerotically deactivated clueless retard who does not know whether his argument is being corroborated or refuted.

I have to say that was ownage in epic fashion. You basically said it.

Palwasha
07-03-2010, 06:31 PM
Please think it through rationally. Being a Pashtun is more basic and more intrinsic to you than being a Moslem. You were a Pashtun as soon as you were a fetus (or embryo or whatever the first stage is), while you became a Moslem when your parents taught you the Kalima and the Shahada when your were about 5. Secondly, your interests always closely knit to your nation/state than your religion.

I wouldn't even be in existence if it was for a soul being put in me, that is down to God, no one else. Don't get me wrong, I'm grateful for the (Pakhtun) blood that flows through my veins, but it's Allah who made it so.

eusuphxai
07-03-2010, 06:34 PM
I am confused i agree, but I am not a hater. I dont follow things. All I was trying to say was if having an identity is good or bad. where does pakistan or afghanistan come from. I don't give f*** about afghanistan of pakistan. I am not one of those who blames others for my downfall. I am not the one who get pleasure in calling pakistan porkisan, or calling taliban=ISI. I am not one of those who run away claimed asylum and talk of bravery. The only brave afghans are dead for thier country, the irony is that u run away from your motherland claim asylum in some peacefull country and claims to be warrior of your beloved land, from a comfortable chair. I know you will make up your mind about anyone who will not abuse pakistan, or shumali ithehad for that matter. There is a lot more to pashtunwali than hating pakistan or shumali ithehad.

someone just mention about for how many years you are pashtun and all that bull**. you are what u r for the day you were born. pa prado ghwaloo teezauna ma achaway. tell me anything which a pasthun has done in last 50 years that you are proud of. the easiet thing is to make fun of someone without actually debating with some logic.

I was just debating if my identity is helping me or stopping me from progressing, in our case we just have this shallow dreams of proud pakhtuns but how many a day do something which make you a proud pakhtun and no calling pakistan porkistan is not one of them, if anyoen of you can proof that calling pakistan will help those pakhtun children in peshwar from begging or if it will all of a sudden educate us all. I will be the first one to call them Pakistan porkistan, pigistan, punjabiyan as haramyan or mother***. Just lemme know and i wont disappoint you with my swearing i can promise that

Nadir Shah
07-03-2010, 06:47 PM
I wouldn't even be in existence if it was for a soul being put in me, that is down to God, no one else. Don't get me wrong, I'm grateful for the (Pakhtun) blood that flows through my veins, but it's Allah who made it so.

I have a completely different and not so pleasent explanation of why you are a Pakhtun.
The point here is that you can follow religion as strongly and as affectionately as you want. It's just that you should not consider everything Arab or with the Islamic prefix as actually Islamic and your religion should not be a hindrance to your national aspirations.

muhsina
07-03-2010, 07:26 PM
Brother I respect your feelings and here is a possible explanation for what we want to say. You have the right to outrightly reject it if it doesnt make sense to you.


I am confused i agree, but I am not a hater.


There is nothing wrong in being a hater. You have to hate bad if you love good. We Pakthuns have to hate all those people,groups,institutions and even those among ourselves who are responsible for the miseries we are going through.

I dont follow things. All I was trying to say was if having an identity is good or bad.

Yess. We heard your view and we opined that without identity we are nothing. A person with no identity is like a free electron without a nucleus. We dont live in space.We need our identity. Even Quran says that:

[I]We have divided you into tribes and ethnic groups so that you can identify.

Where does pakistan or afghanistan come from. I don't give f*** about afghanistan of pakistan.

These two countries have to come into picture as the Pakhtuns who are suffering belong and reside in these two countries. We cannot nelect them.

I am not one of those who blames others for my downfall. I am not the one who get pleasure in calling pakistan porkisan, or calling taliban=ISI.

There are external factors and there are internal factors for the downtrodden status of a nation or group.
When we talk about the military ruling class mainly from Punjab and Karachi in case of Pakistan ,this is where we talk about the external factors.Though these are not the only ones but the major one.

When we talk about our inability not to win our freedom and a respectable status among the league of nations ,it is when we talk about our internal factors. Calling Pakistan as porkistan might be bad but not knowing or acknowleding Taliban to be the religeous terrorist wing of ISI is a refusal of facts.


I am not one of those who run away claimed asylum and talk of bravery. The only brave afghans are dead for thier country, the irony is that u run away from your motherland claim asylum in some peacefull country and claims to be warrior of your beloved land, from a comfortable chair.

I know you will make up your mind about anyone who will not abuse pakistan, or shumali ithehad for that matter. There is a lot more to pashtunwali than hating pakistan or shumali ithehad.


Agreed.

someone just mention about for how many years you are pashtun and all that bull**. you are what u r for the day you were born. pa prado ghwaloo teezauna ma achaway.

Nostagia is a psychotic state of mind but ignoring history results in loss of sense of proportion too.

tell me anything which a pasthun has done in last 50 years that you are proud of.

In case of Pakistan ,if we have not done anyhting great that is due to the fact that we have not been free and a slave mind cannot think freely and freedom is the first pre requisite for doing anything great. That is why we are striving for freedom.

the easiet thing is to make fun of someone without actually debating with some logic. I was just debating if my identity is helping me or stopping me from progressing, in our case we just have this shallow dreams of proud pakhtuns but how many a day do something which make you a proud pakhtun and no calling pakistan porkistan is not one of them, if anyoen of you can proof that calling pakistan will help those pakhtun children in peshwar from begging or if it will all of a sudden educate us all. I will be the first one to call them Pakistan porkistan, pigistan, punjabiyan as haramyan or mother***. Just lemme know and i wont disappoint you with my swearing i can promise that.

Apart from the emotional part, the linguists of the world and all social scientists agree that unless you get education in your own mother language and unless you are free you cannot achieve anything really great in life. Ofcourse this is not possible with an enslaved status [like we have in Pakistan] where we even dont know who we are and are debating out identity instead of owning our pakhtun /afghan nation and history and striving for higher altruistic ideals in life, let alone getting education in our lanuage.

eusuphxai
07-03-2010, 07:53 PM
before I reply to muhsina, whats with you losers watching it from the side counting scores, it sound like the cowards who are happy to see the good guy hitting the bad guy and u shout hit him hit him, get off your ass and reply with logic rather than ****ting yourself and taking pleasrue from it.

eusuphxai
07-03-2010, 08:17 PM
Are you thier official represntative if yes then in that case I accpet your appologies,

I will try not to say the word ass again, sorry about that but nothing wrong with anything else I said.

eusuphxai
07-03-2010, 08:37 PM
@ muhsina:

There is a lot wrong with being a hater, hate is an attribute associated with losers, people who cant do a lot, sign of frustration.

remembering history is good, learning from it is even better, but showing it as an achivement is wrong.

//We have divided you into tribes and ethnic groups so that you can identify. //

But Closer to Allah is one who has Taqwa. so its good to identify each otehr , but if that identity is stopping you from progressing or making you single minded its better not to use it at that time exactly my point use your identity to identify each other not to be proud of. Be proud of your achivements not what God has given you not of your default setting

BLS_1919v2.0
07-03-2010, 09:17 PM
I am confused i agree, but I am not a hater. I dont follow things. All I was trying to say was if having an identity is good or bad. where does pakistan or afghanistan come from. I don't give f*** about afghanistan of pakistan. I am not one of those who blames others for my downfall. I am not the one who get pleasure in calling pakistan porkisan, or calling taliban=ISI. I am not one of those who run away claimed asylum and talk of bravery. The only brave afghans are dead for thier country, the irony is that u run away from your motherland claim asylum in some peacefull country and claims to be warrior of your beloved land, from a comfortable chair. I know you will make up your mind about anyone who will not abuse pakistan, or shumali ithehad for that matter. There is a lot more to pashtunwali than hating pakistan or shumali ithehad.

someone just mention about for how many years you are pashtun and all that bull**. you are what u r for the day you were born. pa prado ghwaloo teezauna ma achaway. tell me anything which a pasthun has done in last 50 years that you are proud of. the easiet thing is to make fun of someone without actually debating with some logic.

I was just debating if my identity is helping me or stopping me from progressing, in our case we just have this shallow dreams of proud pakhtuns but how many a day do something which make you a proud pakhtun and no calling pakistan porkistan is not one of them, if anyoen of you can proof that calling pakistan will help those pakhtun children in peshwar from begging or if it will all of a sudden educate us all. I will be the first one to call them Pakistan porkistan, pigistan, punjabiyan as haramyan or mother***. Just lemme know and i wont disappoint you with my swearing i can promise that

Nice rant, but guess what:

- a lot of us are not in the west because of asylum...no da garmee teezoona thaa wachoal nor na.
- whether your identity crisis hinders your success or progress is quite frankly up to you as an individual.
- A lot of people don't need to resort to name calling. See there is a thing called political interests and then rants or slogans (which you were just doing). What that has to do with pashtunwali or cursing is again your own confusion. People here are very content with their pashto and politics. I think you are not.
- I don't care what panjabiyaan do, they have their own culture land and life.
- What you consider being a 'hater' is actually a misconception. A lot of members here have set up their opinions and backed them up. Maybe you should go to the political forum, rather than judging people.


P.S. Muhsina still owned you, so if you are ranting due to that, that is a little narrow if I do say so myself. Oh and calling people cowards behind a computer screen is ironic.

muhsina
07-03-2010, 09:20 PM
There is a lot wrong with being a hater, hate is an attribute associated with losers, people who cant do a lot, sign of frustration.

remembering history is good, learning from it is even better, but showing it as an achivement is wrong.


Grana wrora

I gave you the argument of the top aestheticians if the modern world who have written dozens of books on the philosoophy of love and hatred,good and bad and right and wrong and you are quoting me the quotable quotes of class 8th which the school boys tell each other on birthdays.
Unfair da kana.


//We have divided you into tribes and ethnic groups so that you can identify. //

But Closer to Allah is one who has Taqwa. so its good to identify each othr , but if that identity is stopping you from progressing or making you single minded its better not to use it at that time exactly my point use your identity to identify each other not to be proud of. Be proud of your achivements not what God has given you not of your default setting.


Yes you can get rid of identity if it is an impediment in the way to your progress and prosperity but as I already stated ,my hyper brave brother, that the Linguists and social scientist agree that the learning process for an individiual is much faster in one's own language,which is the first element of identity. Now as learning implies knowledge ,which is the key to progress hence any element of identity is NOT a hurdle or impediment in the progress of an individual.

The same is true for a nation. No artificially amalgamated nation [if it can be called one] can make progress if lacks its te elements of its identity which are land,language,lineage or leader from within its own people. You see even the sacred book of Muslims refers to this fact that we sent these leaders [prophets] to every nation from within that nation.

I dont want to discuss "taqwa" as it will become specific to muslims ,but if you are interested to discuss it, let me know so we succinctly scrutinise the literature written on QURAN and SUNNAH [though I am least interested in it].

eusuphxai
07-03-2010, 09:46 PM
a lot of us are not in the west because of asylum .. the facts tell me otherwise.


whether your identity crisis hinders your success or progress is quite frankly up to you as an individual. Agreed.

A lot of people don't need to resort to name calling. See there is a thing called political interests and then rants or slogans (which you were just doing). What that has to do with pashtunwali or cursing is again your own confusion. People here are very content with their pashto and politics. I think you are not. again you are right I am not content about it, and what I have seen from people response that no one else is either, so just dont make statements, talk logic if you can


I don't care what panjabiyaan do, they have their own culture land and life. I appreciate that, but the reality is not everyone think as you do.


P.S. Muhsina still owned you, so if you are ranting due to that, that is a little narrow if I do say so myself. Oh and calling people cowards behind a computer screen is ironic. muhsina still owned me good wish you had the balls to do so, and Allah is my witness if it was face to face I woudnt have said a word different.

BLS_1919v2.0
07-03-2010, 09:48 PM
a lot of us are not in the west because of asylum .. the facts tell me otherwise.


whether your identity crisis hinders your success or progress is quite frankly up to you as an individual. Agreed.

A lot of people don't need to resort to name calling. See there is a thing called political interests and then rants or slogans (which you were just doing). What that has to do with pashtunwali or cursing is again your own confusion. People here are very content with their pashto and politics. I think you are not. again you are right I am not content about it, and what I have seen from people response that no one else is either, so just dont make statements, talk logic if you can


I don't care what panjabiyaan do, they have their own culture land and life. I appreciate that, but the reality is not everyone think as you do.


P.S. Muhsina still owned you, so if you are ranting due to that, that is a little narrow if I do say so myself. Oh and calling people cowards behind a computer screen is ironic. muhsina still owned me good wish you had the balls to do so, and Allah is my witness if it was face to face I woudnt have said a word different.

I didn't need to, she did the job. It was never an issue of 'balls'. I just came and cleared things up. BTW many people can throw generalizations, it isn't hard. Quite frankly you are doing the same.

eusuphxai
07-03-2010, 09:53 PM
Yes you can get rid of identity if it is an impediment in the way to your progress and prosperity but as I already stated ,my hyper brave brother, that the Linguists and social scientist agree that the learning process for an individiual is much faster in one's own language,which is the first element of identity you can debate without being sarcastic I m the most coward person you will meet, I agree with that learning process, and i never said identity was bad, I said IF it is stopping us from progressing it is bad, whenever it helps us in progressing we should grab it with both hands.

and I left school in class 5 so I am still doing better for my class, and I just told you what you said out of context. Identity is to identify each other not to something to be proud of

eusuphxai
07-03-2010, 10:52 PM
Also you mentioned learning in ones own language makes learning easier, only fools will disagree with it and neither am I disagreeing that its not a part of identity, My point was Identity should help us in progressing and should not stop us from progressing.

also when I said paranoid (there were so many post that i lost to reply to that), was not to the first bit of your post but when u spoke about pakistan, not that I care about it, i am too selfish to care about pakistan etc.